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	<title>Comments on: All the News that&#8217;s Fit</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.fairblog.org/2008/07/10/all-the-news-thats-fit/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.fairblog.org/2008/07/10/all-the-news-thats-fit/</link>
	<description>Defending Mormonism</description>
	<pubDate>Tue, 06 Jan 2009 00:13:04 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: FAIR Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; A Note from a Clown</title>
		<link>http://www.fairblog.org/2008/07/10/all-the-news-thats-fit/comment-page-1/#comment-3836</link>
		<dc:creator>FAIR Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; A Note from a Clown</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jul 2008 21:13:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fairblog.org/?p=99#comment-3836</guid>
		<description>[...] a previous blog post I mentioned how Simon Southerton “has been trying to polarize apologists and others who promote [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] a previous blog post I mentioned how Simon Southerton “has been trying to polarize apologists and others who promote [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Seth R.</title>
		<link>http://www.fairblog.org/2008/07/10/all-the-news-thats-fit/comment-page-1/#comment-3776</link>
		<dc:creator>Seth R.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 00:25:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fairblog.org/?p=99#comment-3776</guid>
		<description>Fox News picks up any news story with "porn" or sex in it as a matter of course. It's part of their marketing approach. Since this story was about sex, the fact that Fox ran with it is really not surprising in the least.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fox News picks up any news story with &#8220;porn&#8221; or sex in it as a matter of course. It&#8217;s part of their marketing approach. Since this story was about sex, the fact that Fox ran with it is really not surprising in the least.</p>
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		<title>By: Hans</title>
		<link>http://www.fairblog.org/2008/07/10/all-the-news-thats-fit/comment-page-1/#comment-3739</link>
		<dc:creator>Hans</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Jul 2008 00:36:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fairblog.org/?p=99#comment-3739</guid>
		<description>Not that this is directly on topic to Signature books, but the AP and Fox News picked up the disciplinary actions against the missionary calendar guy. 

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,381063,00.html

The fact that this made national news is laughable, let alone being the cover story on foxnews.com. So in the same thought at the original post title, is this really fit to print? Is there nothing else more important to report in the world today?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not that this is directly on topic to Signature books, but the AP and Fox News picked up the disciplinary actions against the missionary calendar guy. </p>
<p><a href="http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,381063,00.html" onclick="javascript:pageTracker._trackPageview('/outbound/comment/www.foxnews.com');" rel="nofollow">http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,381063,00.html</a></p>
<p>The fact that this made national news is laughable, let alone being the cover story on foxnews.com. So in the same thought at the original post title, is this really fit to print? Is there nothing else more important to report in the world today?</p>
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		<title>By: Ben</title>
		<link>http://www.fairblog.org/2008/07/10/all-the-news-thats-fit/comment-page-1/#comment-3738</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 23:25:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fairblog.org/?p=99#comment-3738</guid>
		<description>You can read one of Card's BoM articles at http://www.nauvoo.com/library/card-bookofmormon.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You can read one of Card&#8217;s BoM articles at <a href="http://www.nauvoo.com/library/card-bookofmormon.html" onclick="javascript:pageTracker._trackPageview('/outbound/comment/www.nauvoo.com');" rel="nofollow">http://www.nauvoo.com/library/card-bookofmormon.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Allen Wyatt</title>
		<link>http://www.fairblog.org/2008/07/10/all-the-news-thats-fit/comment-page-1/#comment-3727</link>
		<dc:creator>Allen Wyatt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 13:05:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fairblog.org/?p=99#comment-3727</guid>
		<description>Mr. Card's "screed to end all screeds" is located over at &lt;a href="http://www.mormontimes.com/ME_blogs.php?id=1486" rel="nofollow"&gt;Mormon Times&lt;/a&gt;. It is worth reading to see if folks agree it is worthy of such an appellation.

-Allen</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr. Card&#8217;s &#8220;screed to end all screeds&#8221; is located over at <a href="http://www.mormontimes.com/ME_blogs.php?id=1486" onclick="javascript:pageTracker._trackPageview('/outbound/comment/www.mormontimes.com');" rel="nofollow">Mormon Times</a>. It is worth reading to see if folks agree it is worthy of such an appellation.</p>
<p>-Allen</p>
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		<title>By: Lee Wyatt</title>
		<link>http://www.fairblog.org/2008/07/10/all-the-news-thats-fit/comment-page-1/#comment-3725</link>
		<dc:creator>Lee Wyatt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 12:43:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fairblog.org/?p=99#comment-3725</guid>
		<description>This may be off topic, and if so, I do apologize. I have long been a fan of Mr. Card's ficitonal work, and would love to be able to read some of his statements along the lines of apologetics and such, if only to get a greater insight into his thinking process. Would anyone happen to know where I can find his blog, or web site? Whaterver help you can give me I would appreciate.

To get back to the thread: I think that this shows (i.e. Signature's comments) how some people feel the necessity to reach out and latch onto anything even remotely linked to their topic or subject matter to try and prove their point. It would be laughable, if it wasn't so pitiful.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This may be off topic, and if so, I do apologize. I have long been a fan of Mr. Card&#8217;s ficitonal work, and would love to be able to read some of his statements along the lines of apologetics and such, if only to get a greater insight into his thinking process. Would anyone happen to know where I can find his blog, or web site? Whaterver help you can give me I would appreciate.</p>
<p>To get back to the thread: I think that this shows (i.e. Signature&#8217;s comments) how some people feel the necessity to reach out and latch onto anything even remotely linked to their topic or subject matter to try and prove their point. It would be laughable, if it wasn&#8217;t so pitiful.</p>
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		<title>By: Greg Smith</title>
		<link>http://www.fairblog.org/2008/07/10/all-the-news-thats-fit/comment-page-1/#comment-3721</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 05:54:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fairblog.org/?p=99#comment-3721</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Way to get ‘em where it hurts — spelling errors! Yeah, FAIR! You show Signature Books just how superior your are in every regard! Yeah!&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Given that Allen is an editor in his day job, such things probably stand out to him.  (I know whereof I speak, having felt the sting of the red pen....)

But, I note you failed to mention all the other errors and oversights in Signature's "news" item:

* They oversimplify what "faithful" members have said and believed about the origin of Amerindians (shades of Southerton, who apparently still hasn't got it--but, this isn't surprising, since his whole thesis depends on there being one and only one "Mormon" view of the issue).
* They claim Meldrum has "the backing" of Mormon bishops.  What is such backing?  How would we know?  Does his own bishop "back" him?  It isn't petty to ask for evidence.  I've seen no e-mails from any Church leader that were favorable toward Meldrum.  While some may exist, I would like to see them.
* They claim Wyatt ridiculded Meldrum.  Again, evidence?  Can anyone show any ridicule from Wyatt or FAIR's article?
* Failure to engage Card's article, and dismiss it as merely a 'screed.'

This couldn't have anything to do with how Card characterized Signature in the past, could it?

&lt;blockquote&gt;Signature [Books] is an anti–Mormon publisher that covers itself the way Playboy has traditionally covered its pornography, by publishing a few articles by serious writers in every issue...By publishing a few books that meet standards of respectable scholarship on LDS topics, Signature gives the false impression that they are a "balanced" publisher, when in fact their unrelenting agenda is to publish books designed to shake the foundations of the Mormon religion. Their prey is the budding Mormon intellectual who takes pride in being smart and educated but does not yet have the critical skills to recognize manipulation and deception when they are masked in the forms of scholarship. - Orson Scott Card to Louis Midgley, 14 April 2004.  A copy of this letter can be found in the Papers of Louis C. Midgley (MSS 2806), in the L. Tom Perry Special Collections, Harold B. Lee Library, Brigham Young University, Provo, Utah; cited in Louis Midgley, "The Signature Books Saga," &lt;i&gt;FARMS Review&lt;/i&gt; 16:1 (2004): 361–406.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Are these trivial points, unworthy of mention?  If not, why focus merely on the (introductory) issues of spelling and fact checking?  You wouldn't want to ignore the meat of the issue you imply Wyatt didn't mention, would you?  ;-)

Signature and its authors like to portray themselves as somehow speaking the "objective" (or "functionally objective") truth about Mormonism.  Yet, their standards here don't seem particularly high.

Which I don't find surprising, but I do find funny.

Greg</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Way to get ‘em where it hurts — spelling errors! Yeah, FAIR! You show Signature Books just how superior your are in every regard! Yeah!</p></blockquote>
<p>Given that Allen is an editor in his day job, such things probably stand out to him.  (I know whereof I speak, having felt the sting of the red pen&#8230;.)</p>
<p>But, I note you failed to mention all the other errors and oversights in Signature&#8217;s &#8220;news&#8221; item:</p>
<p>* They oversimplify what &#8220;faithful&#8221; members have said and believed about the origin of Amerindians (shades of Southerton, who apparently still hasn&#8217;t got it&#8211;but, this isn&#8217;t surprising, since his whole thesis depends on there being one and only one &#8220;Mormon&#8221; view of the issue).<br />
* They claim Meldrum has &#8220;the backing&#8221; of Mormon bishops.  What is such backing?  How would we know?  Does his own bishop &#8220;back&#8221; him?  It isn&#8217;t petty to ask for evidence.  I&#8217;ve seen no e-mails from any Church leader that were favorable toward Meldrum.  While some may exist, I would like to see them.<br />
* They claim Wyatt ridiculded Meldrum.  Again, evidence?  Can anyone show any ridicule from Wyatt or FAIR&#8217;s article?<br />
* Failure to engage Card&#8217;s article, and dismiss it as merely a &#8217;screed.&#8217;</p>
<p>This couldn&#8217;t have anything to do with how Card characterized Signature in the past, could it?</p>
<blockquote><p>Signature [Books] is an anti–Mormon publisher that covers itself the way Playboy has traditionally covered its pornography, by publishing a few articles by serious writers in every issue&#8230;By publishing a few books that meet standards of respectable scholarship on LDS topics, Signature gives the false impression that they are a &#8220;balanced&#8221; publisher, when in fact their unrelenting agenda is to publish books designed to shake the foundations of the Mormon religion. Their prey is the budding Mormon intellectual who takes pride in being smart and educated but does not yet have the critical skills to recognize manipulation and deception when they are masked in the forms of scholarship. - Orson Scott Card to Louis Midgley, 14 April 2004.  A copy of this letter can be found in the Papers of Louis C. Midgley (MSS 2806), in the L. Tom Perry Special Collections, Harold B. Lee Library, Brigham Young University, Provo, Utah; cited in Louis Midgley, &#8220;The Signature Books Saga,&#8221; <i>FARMS Review</i> 16:1 (2004): 361–406.</p></blockquote>
<p>Are these trivial points, unworthy of mention?  If not, why focus merely on the (introductory) issues of spelling and fact checking?  You wouldn&#8217;t want to ignore the meat of the issue you imply Wyatt didn&#8217;t mention, would you?  <img src='http://www.fairblog.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Signature and its authors like to portray themselves as somehow speaking the &#8220;objective&#8221; (or &#8220;functionally objective&#8221;) truth about Mormonism.  Yet, their standards here don&#8217;t seem particularly high.</p>
<p>Which I don&#8217;t find surprising, but I do find funny.</p>
<p>Greg</p>
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		<title>By: BHodges</title>
		<link>http://www.fairblog.org/2008/07/10/all-the-news-thats-fit/comment-page-1/#comment-3718</link>
		<dc:creator>BHodges</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 04:24:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fairblog.org/?p=99#comment-3718</guid>
		<description>Sure, I think the post was a little too far on the snarky side. But in addition to that was the more interesting question of why this "news" appeared on the Signature site to begin with, and why they misrepresent Orson Scott Card, etc.  

Even more interesting, though, is your response's snarkiness:

"Way to get ‘em where it hurts — spelling errors! Yeah, FAIR! You show Signature Books just how superior your are in every regard! Yeah!"

Aren't you stooping as well, then?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sure, I think the post was a little too far on the snarky side. But in addition to that was the more interesting question of why this &#8220;news&#8221; appeared on the Signature site to begin with, and why they misrepresent Orson Scott Card, etc.  </p>
<p>Even more interesting, though, is your response&#8217;s snarkiness:</p>
<p>&#8220;Way to get ‘em where it hurts — spelling errors! Yeah, FAIR! You show Signature Books just how superior your are in every regard! Yeah!&#8221;</p>
<p>Aren&#8217;t you stooping as well, then?</p>
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		<title>By: Patrick</title>
		<link>http://www.fairblog.org/2008/07/10/all-the-news-thats-fit/comment-page-1/#comment-3715</link>
		<dc:creator>Patrick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 02:46:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fairblog.org/?p=99#comment-3715</guid>
		<description>Allen, it's not what you said, but how you said it.

BHodges, shouldn't we all expect more from not only Signature Books, but also FAIR? I'm not defending Signature's news blurb at all, but nor do I find it necessary to cheer on FAIR in their equally ridiculous response.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Allen, it&#8217;s not what you said, but how you said it.</p>
<p>BHodges, shouldn&#8217;t we all expect more from not only Signature Books, but also FAIR? I&#8217;m not defending Signature&#8217;s news blurb at all, but nor do I find it necessary to cheer on FAIR in their equally ridiculous response.</p>
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		<title>By: TrevorM</title>
		<link>http://www.fairblog.org/2008/07/10/all-the-news-thats-fit/comment-page-1/#comment-3714</link>
		<dc:creator>TrevorM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 02:40:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fairblog.org/?p=99#comment-3714</guid>
		<description>I am with Edmund.  We have to up our level of courtesy on all sides.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am with Edmund.  We have to up our level of courtesy on all sides.</p>
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